Interbeing: An Interview with Gerui Grace Ma, Part I

Gerui Grace Ma is in her second year in Pacifica’s M.A. Depth Psychology and Creativity with Emphasis in the Arts and Humanities program. I’m excited to hear about her work in Beijing and her experience at Pacifica in this two part interview. The M.A. Depth Psychology and Creativity with Emphasis in the Arts and Humanities program is now accepting applications for Fall 2025.

Angela Borda: Thank you so much for speaking with me today. I would love to hear a little about your background and the formative experiences that have shaped who you are.

Gerui Grace Ma: I grew up in Beijing, in a family deeply connected to the arts and creativity. My mother is an accomplished instrumentalist who plays the erhu, a traditional Chinese instrument similar to the violin but with only two strings. My stepfather is involved in the arts as well, working at a dance academy in Beijing. From a young age, I was very poetic and immersed myself in music—participating in choirs, playing instruments, and even writing collections of poetry. However, despite my passion for the arts, I never had the confidence to pursue creative work as a career.

After high school, I did my undergraduate studies in a design program in Sweden. There, I focused on UI/UX design and front-end programming. I’ve worked in this field for a while, but I’ve always felt that I didn’t fully express my deeper creativity or satisfy my spiritual needs as a Buddhist. This sense of dissatisfaction led me to Pacifica last year, where I could explore and integrate my understanding of both Eastern and Western psychosomatic experiences, bridging my spiritual explorations with tangible works. It’s been a journey of reconnecting with my true creative self.

Angela: To participate in your degree program at Pacifica, you make a 20-hour plane flight to be with us here on campus. How did you find Pacifica and what inspires you to make the long journey from Beijing to Santa Barbara four times a year?

Grace: During the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020, I found myself quarantined in China and hard to return to Sweden, where I had planned to continue my life after graduation. That time of isolation brought on a deep crisis of meaning for me. I questioned why I was living a life that felt so detached from creativity and purpose. Although I had a creative job as a designer, I was stuck in repetitive, technical tasks that didn’t fulfill my soul. I sensed a profound gap between my spiritual values and my work, and I longed to bridge that divide.

It was during this time that I met my husband, Yang, who had studied in CIIS and was a former student of Richard Tarnas. He introduced me to Pacifica and encouraged me to explore its programs. When I discovered the Depth Psychology and Creativity program, it felt like a synchronistic moment—like the opportunity I had been searching for. The program offered me the opportunity to explore what it means to work as a creative person without losing touch with my spirituality. Dr. Susan Rowland’s work, in particular, has been instrumental in helping me to “heal the split” between these parts of myself.

Angela: What is your experience of the Humanities program? How has depth psychology and the program impacted you and your creative endeavors?

Grace: My experience in the Humanities program has been truly enriching. I’m surrounded by incredibly creative individuals—dancers, poets, visual artists, musicians—and it’s fascinating to witness how the combination of depth psychology and creativity unfolds. I have found that this space allows me to build on my design background while exploring new creative avenues. This year at DCH, I started to explore a new creative role as a musician, which was an unexpected but exciting development.

Creativity is, ultimately, my true calling, and depth psychology is helping me explore what creativity really means and how to nurture it. How can I cultivate and unlock my creative potential? Professor Rowland’s work on Jungian-based arts research has had a profound impact on me. I’ve already based at least two of my projects on her theories. The idea of using art as a legitimate research method, or placing art on the same level as science, has given me a renewed sense of purpose and a sense of hope for transdisciplinary work.

In my studio back in Beijing, I’m actively exploring how to integrate science, religion, and art—allowing these realms to communicate with one another without a dominant authority figure. Professor Rowland’s frameworks have provided invaluable support in this pursuit. When I bring this work together with my Buddhist studies, it becomes even more powerful. Both systems are dedicated to healing the split between the “self” and the “world,” and that intersection feels like a vital and transformative space for me.

Angela: Tell us more about your studio, please.

Grace: Yes, my husband and I run a studio called Metaxy. It’s a space where we offer mindfulness meditation and courses focused on Buddhist philosophy. I like to think of it as an alchemical space—one that invites transformation and self-discovery. The studio is designed for those who are curious about mindfulness and traditional Buddhist teachings, but it’s not a typical Buddhist temple.

What makes Metaxy unique is its community-based approach. There is no central authority figure guiding the experience. Instead, it’s a place where everyone contributes to each other’s spiritual journey, creating a shared sense of growth and exploration. It’s an open, collaborative environment where people can connect with these ancient teachings in a way that feels accessible, inclusive, and dynamic.

***Part II of this interview coming shortly.***

The M.A. Depth Psychology and Creativity with Emphasis in the Arts and Humanities program is now accepting applications for Fall 2025. For more information, please visit us here.

Grace Ma is the Co-founder of Metaxy Studio Beijing, an advocate of Buddhist philosophy and a mindfulness and creativity facilitator. A transdisciplinary artist crafting mindfulness music, visual art, and poetry. China’s first master’s student in Depth Psychology and Creativity at Pacifica Graduate Institute, with a B.A. in Informatics specializing in New Media Design from Sweden. Honored by the Swedish Ministry for Foreign Affairs in 2020 for outstanding achievements in social innovation and entrepreneurship.

Interbeing Music Credits:
Lyrics taken from the Sanskrit Heart Sutra
Composer/Chanting/Gu-Zheng: Grace Ma
Arranger/Adaptor/Vocal Recording and Mixing Engineer: Minmin Yan
Violin: Rebecca Sabine
Violin Recording Engineer: Aaron Ramsey
Erhu: Ziwei Liu
Music Production: Fente Music Studio Beijing
Media campaign: Zhiyi Zhou
Planning: Metaxy Studio Beijing (Grace Ma & Guang Yang)

Angela_1

Angela Borda is a writer for Pacifica Graduate Institute, as well as the editor of the Santa Barbara Literary Journal. Her work has been published in Food & Home, Peregrine, Hurricanes & Swan Songs, Delirium Corridor, Still Arts Quarterly, Danse Macabre, and is forthcoming in The Tertiary Lodger and Running Wild Anthology of Stories, Vol. 5.